We started the week saying it’s all about relationships, friendships, and partnerships in ministry. In fact, we have been singing this song for two weeks now. Yes, we all need relationships to make it in ministry. We need support. We need encouragement. We need friends. But… What about others like us? What about pastors in our area, or pastors who we know, that just might be dying on the vine? What if we turned the tables on ourselves and thought about others who might need the very same things as they pastor their 200church?
As we close out this week, we would like to ask you to think of others, and specifically think of someone by name – a real pastor, who could benefit from your phone call or email. A man or woman in ministry who needs the encouragement you could gift to them today or tomorrow – who are they? What is their name? You could:
It’s not what you do that is so important, it’s that you do something! We’re on the same team, and sometimes we need an “Attaboy!” or “Attagirl!”. Sometimes we need that pat on the back or shot in the arm to carry us further down the field. In more than one place in the New Testament (in fact, in four places) we are commanded to “encourage one another.” So we call you to do just that this weekend! Answer these three questions: Who am I going to encourage? _________________________ How will I encourage them? ___________________________ When will I encourage them? __________________________ Don’t forget to KISS it! Keep It Simple Stupid! Don’t make a building project out of it like us pastors are prone to do. Don't make it so complicated - that's when we never get to it. Just do it. Encourage another pastor this weekend. Now, comment and tell us what you are going to do to encourage another 200church pastor this weekend…
Today is the second and final segment of Jeff’s conversation with Rob Tarnoviski who is the Lead Pastor at Bethel Fellowship - The Church @ Franklin Mills. We think you will find it transparent and refreshing as they openly discuss the following topics:
As pastors, we have to balance two competing agendas: 1) those on the inside, and 2) those on the outside. The challenge is that the agenda for those on the outside of the Body of Christ will never be brought to the table, unless ministry leaders bring it for them. When they do, they are often opposed by those inside the church, seeking the insiders’ agendas. Rob talks about how he has created a culture in his church that thinks about the outsiders. This is a balancing act we have to maneuver all the time as pastors. We must feed the sheep, and we must leave the ninety-nine to find the lost sheep. We have to serve the body of Christ, while at the same time reach out to those who are far from Christ. In the last half of the 20th century, so many churches created climates where Christians were encouraged to separate themselves from unbelievers and segregate themselves into Christian schools, Christian social clubs, and Christian communities. Even mega churches created a one stop shop for all of the needs of a Christian family. They increasingly removed the need for the church to associate with the world. Next week we are going to hear the conversation that Jeff and Jonny have with Jim Powell, pastor of Richwoods Christian Church in Peoria, IL. He is the author of the book, Dirt Matters - The Foundation For a Healthy, Vibrant, And Effective Congregation and the founder of the 95Network. We will talk about how the culture of the church matters! His book compares the culture of a church, to the soil that plants grow in – and he surmises that dirt matters. The composition of soil is foundational to how well things grow. In the same way, the culture of a church is foundational to how a church grows. In today’s and last week’s podcast, Pastor Rob essentially talks about the culture of Bethel Fellowship. It is a solidly outsiders oriented culture. They think intentionally about those who aren't there… YET! Bethel has had staff members who have stayed on for many years, and the stability of the church is to their credit!
How about you and your church?
We wonder what kind of culture your church has? What kind of church culture are you trying to create? If you listed the things that bother you most about your ministry, you would see how the culture of your church is causing those very challenges. As you listen to today’s and next week’s podcasts, consider your church culture, and think about how you might begin to shape it intentionally into a culture and environment that will accomplish the very things which comprise the vision of your church. Finally, if you know of other 200church pastors who could be encouraged by the 200churches Podcast, pass along the website to them: www.200churches.com. If you want to share a topic you would like us to spend a week on in the near future, use the speakpipe pop-out on the homepage and send us a voice message, or email either of us at jeff@200churches.com or jonny@200churches.com. YOU are so important to the people who are your church. These are the ones God has called you to care for, feed, love, and protect. Do it with diligence and love. Friends. We need them. We need friends who understand and accept us. We need friends who will love us even when we give them reason not to. How are you doing for friends? Do you have a close friend in whom you could confide your deepest fears, failures, and sins – as well as your highest hopes, joys, and dreams? I have just a couple close friends that fit that category. I think everybody needs at least one! Thankfully, I have good friends. New friends, like Jonny Craig, old friends, like Rob Tarnoviski – and lots of friends in between. Friends live life with us. They make the highs higher, and the lows not quite so low. They multiply our successes and minimize our failures. Ministry friends are important for us to have as pastors. They understand our unique struggles and can empathize with us. They give us insight along the way and guide us away from disasters. Our prayer and wish for you is that you have many life-giving friends who encourage you and lift you up. We have met some new friends since embarking on the 200churches Podcast journey. Just yesterday we talked with a new one on Skype who we hope to invite onto the podcast in the near future. But for now, Jonny and I would like to share just two of our newest ministry friends with you. Karl Vaters is at newsmallchurch.com. We want to welcome back Karl Vaters from Europe/Eastern Europe today! We don’t know about you, but we've missed his contributions to leaders and pastors of small churches throughout the month of September! We've missed his posts at www.newsmallchurch.com. We are very thankful that he was able to travel and do ministry internationally, encouraging leaders of small churches across the ocean. Welcome back Karl! We are excited to have Karl join us on the 200churches Podcast on October 23, 2013 to tell us all about his ministry trip and how he was able to help pastors. Karl shared with pastors the message of his book, The Grasshopper Myth: Big Churches, Small Churches, and the Small Thinking that Divides Us. We are devoting that episode to him so that he can share with all of us what God has done both through him, and in him. That will be Episode 41 of the podcast on Wednesday, October 23, 2013. Watch Jim Powell talk about the 95Network!
Another friend of small church pastors is Jim Powell from the 95Network.com! Jim mentors and coaches leaders of small and medium sized churches through his online coaching video pods. Jonny and I joined him on one recently and it was really helpful and instructive. Jim has encouraged us as we began here at 200churches and we have kept in touch along the way. Jim is joining us on Episode 40 of the podcast on Wednesday, October 16, 2013. He talks with us about his new book, Dirt Matters The Foundation For a Healthy, Vibrant, And Effective Congregation, which delves into the culture of a church and how that affects its health and growth. The “Dirt” refers to the culture, or soil of a church, and what kind of soil is needed to grow a healthy church. We are all busy in ministry, and often too busy to cultivate meaningful community. But we benefit so much when we make time for friends. The day before this post comes out on 200churches.com, I will have met for lunch with a friend I have not seen in at least five years. He’s a pastor in my home state of New York, and as I write this, I can’t wait to see him and catch up on the last five or so years! How about you? Is there a friend you need to call today? Maybe because you need the call, or perhaps because you think he or she may need it? We want to encourage you to invest in friendships, both old and new – and as I’ve always told my kids: “It’s important for you to have the right friends, but it’s equally important for you to be the right friend to others!” p.s. Your love and care for, and leadership of, your 200church matters huge in God’s Kingdom!
Today's podcast is Part 1 of a conversation between Jeff and Rob Tarnoviski. Rob is the Lead Pastor at Bethel Fellowship - The Church @ Franklin Mills, Philadelphia, PA. As you listen to this episode, you will likely be reminded of your own call to ministry, and the successes and missteps along the way to where you are today. The purpose of this conversation is to encourage you in your ministry, and remind you that you are not alone in your doubts and failings in your ministry journey. The key is to persevere, to not give up. You must keep moving forward in faith.
Rob's ministry at Bethel has only seen 17 years. To some of you that is a short time, to others, you can't imagine spending 17 years in your church. But those 17 years were lived one day, one week, one month, and one year at a time. You can do the same. It's always too soon to quit, and it's never quite time to give up. If you believe that the Lord brought you to where you are today, continue. Move past your fear. Move in faith instead. Faith in who God is, and who he made you to be.
You can find Rob's church online at www.fmchurch.net and follow him on Twitter at www.twitter.com/pastorrobfm. We hope Part 1 of this conversation is helpful to you. Part 2 comes next week in Episode 39. Your leadership matters. Stay the course! You can subscribe to The 200churches Podcast and leave us a rating by opening iTunes here. This week on the podcast we share a conversation between Jeff and Rob Tarnoviski, Lead Pastor of Bethel Fellowship, The Church @ Franklin Mills, in Philadelphia PA. They've known each other for 30 years, and have shared countless life experiences together. You’ll get a chance to listen in on the conversation of two friends talking about their life’s passion: ministry. Rob and Jeff have gone in very different directions in ministry. Jeff left home, Rob returned home. Jeff is in his third full time ministry location, Rob is still in his first. Jeff has moved churches in directions of change and transition. Rob’s church was focused philosophically when he got there. Rob finished a graduate degree early on, Jeff is just finishing his.
But they have also gone in very similar directions. Both have been focused on ministry. Both have invested heavily in their friendship. Both have never stopped learning and growing. Both have failed miserably and succeeded greatly. Both have wives and kids who enjoy(ed) living in a ministry family. Neither has stayed the same, both have grown, changed, transformed, and moved on. Neither would espouse many of the doctrinal and ministry philosophies they were educated in thirty years ago. Jeff talks with Rob about his journey of beginning in a church of 80, and over 17 long, wonderful, and difficult years growing with that church to see it today at almost 1,500. Rob is a 200church pastor who never stopped, who outlasted the critics and quitters, and who is just too stubborn or stupid to think that his church can’t reach more people in his community! Rob’s story is not one of meteoric growth. It is one of faithfulness and consistency over time. His story is one of sacrifice and commitment to a community, a staff team, and a body of believers who were willing to join the team, and buy the vision. Rob grew his church in the first 15 years by about 5 people a month. Modest growth by any means, just over a long period of time. In 2013 America, most of us pastor types want rapid, exponential growth over a very short span of time! We are not patient to wait for results, we want them quickly. If we do not enjoy immediate results, we are too ready to jet, to fly, to bounce. Jeff’s conversation with Rob is about plodding, slow, hard ministry over a long stretch of time. We hope that it encourages you to think about your own ministry and what your expectations are… Are you ready to quit? It’s probably too soon. Ready to bounce? You’re likely jumping the gun. Looking up U-Haul’s phone number? Don’t do it quite yet. Life, ministry, and results just take time. Don’t quit. Stay put. Love your people. Depend on God. All easy to say, right? But harder to DO. Who ever said ministry was easy? Yeah, that’s right – no one who ever did ministry! Finally, what’s it all about? It’s about Almighty God – our Creator and Maker. We serve him. It’s about our Lord and Savior Jesus, the Christ, the Son of the Living God. The coming King, and current King of the Kingdom. We follow him. It’s about the Holy Spirit of God, the one who lives within us, counsels us, comforts and empowers us, and gifts us for ministry. We live with him. Our lives in ministry are about GOD. He doesn't call the fit, he fits the called. We’re the called. Called to love and serve. Called to make a difference in the lives of others and expand the Kingdom of God. We get to do this! We’re blessed! We hope that this week you are encouraged personally, and vocationally in your ministry. Your leadership, and shepherding in your 200church matter HUGE in the Kingdom of God! You’ve heard it before: you can’t just accumulate followers, you must also develop leaders. How true that is. If we only accumulate followers, we will wear ourselves out. Followers have needs and demand attention. The more followers we have, the more energy we must put out. In order to build our ministry and multiply our efforts, we must develop leaders. It sounds strategic, businesslike, and difficult – but it need not be! The reason why we want to develop leaders is to gather a team to help us in the work of ministry. When Jesus fed the 5,000, he had them sit down in groups of hundreds and fifties. He then had his disciples help him pass out the fish and the loaves. There were doubtless leaders in each of these groups of people, who stepped forward and assisted in the serving of the meal.
You had Jesus, his disciples, volunteer leaders in the groups of fifties and hundreds, and then the people themselves (followers). If every pastor of a 200church developed a dozen leaders who would oversee portions of the ministry, so much more pastoral care, ministry training, and outreach could be accomplished. If you are going to develop a team of leaders, you want to make sure you start with people who have potential. How can you determine who has potential? Here are four qualities to look for when searching for leaders to develop: Spiritual Interest – A man or woman could have outstanding credentials and abilities, but unless he or she also has an interest in their own walk with God, they will not pass the sniff test of leadership in the church. Too many church leaders are organizationally equipped on the outside, but unspiritual on the inside. Look for a spiritual person who loves the Lord and desires personal spiritual growth. Personal passion – This is not the same as an outgoing personality. Any personality: a phlegmatic, melancholy, choleric, or sanguine can be passionate. They will reveal their passion in different ways. Passion is about drive and determination to reach a goal or desired outcome. It is about someone believing in something so much that it pushes them to do whatever it takes to get it done. Passion picks up when energy runs out. Natural or spiritual gifting – There must be some natural or spiritual gifting present for ministry to be effective. Ideally a person would have gifting aligned with their desired ministry involvement. An instrumentalist on a worship team would be helped by some natural musical gifting. A worship leader would be more effective if they truly worshiped, and were about to relate well to a crowd of worshippers. Don’t confuse willingness with gifting. What a person wants to do is not always what they are gifted to do. Mission alignment – Look for leaders who want to take a ministry in the same direction that the church leaders want to take it. Their philosophy should align with the mission of the church. If the church’s mission is to reach lost people, a youth worker who only wants to work with churched youth will not be a fit. Their interests, passion, and gifting should align with the vision and mission of the church. What leaders are you developing right now? Could you immediately write down three names if you had to? Do those people have the previous four qualities? If you are not developing any leaders right now, could you write down three names of prospective leaders? We would challenge you to develop leaders who could team up with you to work on the ministry of your church with you! Part of pastoring a 200church is to raise up leaders who can join you in the work of ministry. If we equip people to lead, we can accomplish so much more with them, than if we tried to do it all alone. Develop leaders to multiply both yourself and your ministry! How are you developing leaders in your 200church? So again, here we are, 200chuches, all about encouraging pastors of smaller churches – and this week we've been talking about how to break the 200 barrier. Head scratcher, right? Well, no, not really. Because if we are a 200church only because we never realized that we could start another service, or work on any of those other practices that might help move us beyond the 200-stage, then that’s not good, right?! We need to stretch and grow. If we’re not willing to, then maybe that’s a conversation for another post… But, what if we just aren't equipped to handle the complexity that comes with a 300, 500, or 1,200 member church? What if we’re only 26 or 34 years old, fairly inexperienced yet and we can’t do it? Should we quit and move on, hoping our church can find the “right guy” or the “right lady”? That’s where we say NO.
This is where faith comes in, and a self confidence that comes from believing that God has created you, just the way you are, to serve your church, just the way it is, at just this time in history! None of us is as good as the people who are better than us. (Now, that is a profound statement that you just might have to reread!) Really, we aren't. And that’s okay. My wife did not choose the most handsome hunk of a man for her husband – she did not choose the best guy in the county. There were better. But she chose the guy God created to be her husband, for the rest of her life! Yes, that would be ME! Thank you very much. Your church does not have the best pastor in your denomination, or in your state. They don’t. But they chose you, and better, God chose you to serve and love the people who make up your church. Should you do the best you can? Of course! Should you also rejoice that God created the person of YOU to be the pastor to THEM at just this time in all of their lives? Yes! This is another case where it is a yes and yes. Yes you should get better and be passionate for reaching people in your community with the Gospel! And yes you should accept who you are, serve to your potential, and trust God with the rest. Just do your best, and trust God with the size of your church. For whatever reason, God chose guys named Jeff and Jonny to love and serve the people of our church for just this time in the life of our church. We GET to serve! We LOVE serving! And we are accepting of our weaknesses, and undulating in our abilities at the same time. (you might have to look that word up!) Pray this prayer with me, would you? “God, thanks for making me just like I am. I accept your wisdom in my calling here at my church. I also trust in your power in me to shepherd these people, and reach out to this community. My calling is from you and I commit myself to you and these people – in ministry and Kingdom service. Use me. I love you. Amen!” Last thoughts: We are so excited with the upcoming episodes we have to share with you! We have some great guests lined up, and great content and conversations we know will encourage and inspire you as you pastor a phenomenal 200church! If you haven’t yet, subscribe to both our blog and podcast, and we would be honored to walk alongside you in ministry.
As we said in Monday's post, today's podcast is based on an article by Timothy Keller, New York City pastor and author, titled Leadership and Church Size Dynamics. This article describes churches at each size level, and identifies three things: 1) the character of a church that size 2) How that size church grows, and 3) what it takes for that size church to break through the barrier to the next size category.
Keller says that a 200church's character is highly relational. The people all want to know everyone in the church personally, and they feel responsible to be a part of any ministry or event that takes place. Communication is still informal, and the pastor is in the role of a shepherd.
Change still happens relationally and from the bottom up, and is processed by the whole congregation, and the leaders generally won't make a decision if it will cost them any church members. How a 200church grows is that newcomer's are attracted by having relationships in the congregation. In churches under 100, people are attracted by having a personal relationship to the pastor. What it takes to move a 200church across the 200 barrier and toward the 300 range is five-fold:
Is there anything in your 200church that is keeping it under 200 people? What is keeping your church from growing? Pastor Steve Spear just finished running from California's Pacific Coast all the way to New York City - for real! This guy ran one step at a time all the way across America. No marathon ending injuries, no one ran him over, no flooding swept him away, and no blisters halted his pace. He did this all to raise money for clean water for life in an African community of 30,000 people. "I hate running! I only had four goals: to hate running less each time I ran..." Yet, this man ran 120 marathons, coast to coast, with a goal to raise 1.5 million dollars to provide clean water for life to 30,000 people in Kenya! He's not there yet, but you can help... Perhaps others have done this, but not many. Steve is in an elite group. He just finished his foot trek a few days ago, having spent the entire summer running about 35 miles daily, taking only one day a week off, and wearing out ten pairs of Asics running shoes in the process!
We interviewed Steve on the 200churches Podcast. You can find that interview, and links to Steve and the organization he’s partnering with, World Vision, RIGHT HERE. If you skip over to our Podcast page by clicking the tab at the top of this page, you can download the mp3 of Episode 22 and listen to it anytime. (Right click on the "download the mp3" link and select "save link as...") Jonny and I want to say CONGRATULATIONS to Steve and encourage you to consider watching his story here, and giving to his cause – to provide clean water for life to men, women, and children in Africa. God bless you Steve. And… you da man!
What's it like to raise ministry kids? Well, honestly, not a whole lot different than raising any other kids! We believe that raising kids in the context of ministry in the local church is a huge benefit. Being a pastor's kid has its pros and cons, but we think there a ton more pros!
In Episode 34, Jeff and Jonny talk about pastor's kids, and are joined by Jeff's son, Doug. Doug and Jonny are both pastor's kids and have grown up in a ministry family. Jonny has two preschool sons, and Jeff has three adult children, and one at home. In this episode, you get both perspectives: raising pastor's kids, and being one!
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