On episode #78, we talk with Karl "the Shark" Vaters about the astonishing power of small churches! This coincides with his 7th of 12 "Essential" blog posts on his blog and website at NewSmallChurch.com. Karl Vaters is one of our monthly partners who talks with us about all things small church ministry.
In this episode we wonder what is the fastest growing religion in the world. Here is where you can get some current information on this!
We talk with Karl about the strategy that God is using by placing small churches, or 200churches, all over the globe in every country, proclaiming through word and deed the Gospel of Jesus. These small churches (including ours and yours!) are living out the Kingdom values of Jesus in their communities.
As we pastor these churches we can partner with each other for encouragement and relationship, and in this way work together for the advancing of the Kingdom of God! The fact that our churches are small is not a problem, but in fact an advantage as we are able to reach out to people who are, by nature of their very wiring, averse to large churches. Many people just fit better within a small church context. They would never regularly attend a megachurch simply because God has wired them for small contexts. So, our churches are uniquely positioned to reach out to them. Therefore, we should attempt to become the best, most healthy, most ready small churches we can be to welcome and love new people. The fact that people come to our church means that we are meeting their needs. Small churches has a special role and purpose that larger churches just cannot fill or meet. Let's be thankful to God and proud of how he has made us! Karl's goal at NewSmallChurch.com is the same as ours, to encourage healthy small churches by encouraging and equipping small church pastors. Karl's gift is writing and blogging post after post on the topic of small churches. We say that he is a rabid small church defender and encourager. Our gift is to produce a podcast episode every week that speaks to the hearts and needs of pastors of small churches, and Karl joins us in the venture, while we try to point you to his site, where you will find more great training and resources. Remember, that's NewSmallChurch.com! Next week, on episode #79, we talk with a first time guest on the 200churches Podcast - our friend and mentor, Doug Grogan! Doug works all day every day with small church pastors and their churches. He is going to bring the heat with a ton of wisdom and ministry encouragement for you! A new voice - and a fun friend!
The 200 Barrier. Just seeing those words strikes fear into the hearts of small church pastors. Did you shake in your boots a bit when you saw that? Did you feel inadequate? Guilty? Like you just can't cut it?
WELL DON'T! You are doing Kingdom work. You are making a difference in people's lives. You are leading a church that is important to God. You are not defined by the number of people in your congregation and you are definitely not less-than because you haven't broken a so-called barrier.
Today on the Podcast, we talk with Karl from NewSmallChurch.com about the dreaded 200 barrier and why 80% of churches will never get past it. In fact, we are discussing the content of one of Karl's essential 12 blog posts, #6 - The Surprising Reason 80% of Churches Will Never Break the 200 Barrier.
As usual, Karl is full of encouraging thoughts for small church pastors. Karl encourages us to see ourselves the way God does, rather than letting the church-growth mentality drag us down. Maybe the most poignant thing Karl brings up is the real reason he (and most of us) will never cross the 200 barrier: we stink at running systems and being administrators. Karl knows that he is a gifted teacher, counselor and peacemaker, but none of those skills really translated over into a bigger context. Karl recognizes his strengths and weaknesses and is set free because of it! Instead of deluding ourselves into believing we're something we're not, we could all follow Karl's example of self-awareness which leads to greater fulfillment. It's so easy to get discouraged in the church-growth culture of American Christianity, but our churches need us to stay focused on the positive. That positive is this: God is using small churches across the globe to further His mission and bring people to Christ. Instead of seeing 200 as a barrier, we can see it as an opportunity to do big ministry in a small context. Instead of thinking about it as a barrier, we can recognize the unique advantages that having fewer than 200 people allows us to have. Finally - we think 200 is juuuuuuuust right. More than that is just too dangerous! :) Check it out...Tonight I’m thinking about the podcast episode that comes out this week on Wednesday. It’s another good one! It will be titled “Lessons From Two Laymen – What Every Pastor Needs To Hear.” On episode #70 we talk with Mark Meyers, a 200church pastor from Warrenton, MO. Mark is joined by two of his guys, Steve and Tory. Mark has done a masterful job of leading his church according to a principle I have long believed in: The ministries of a church should reflect the gifting of the people. Mark’s guys talk about how he approached them as a pastor, looking for what made them tick, and what types of activities would make their eyes light up. It seems that he’s tailored his ministry around the gifting of the people in his church.
What Steve and Tory share is invaluable for a small church pastor to hear. Steve and Tory are part of Mark’s leadership team and integral to their sports outreach ministry. I found myself reviewing in my mind how I interact with the folks in our town and the people in our church. I was challenged by their perspectives. One of my mantras has been that phrase, the ministries of a church should reflect the gifting of the people – is that true in your church? Or do you find yourself trying to recruit people to prop up ministries that should have been discontinued long ago. Henry Cloud would call them “Necessary Endings.” And, he would smile as he said it! I was also thinking about something John Maxwell has long said, which he calls the Law of the Inner Circle: Those closest to you determine the level of your success. Well, I would adjust that a little for this conversation and say, Those in your church determine the ministries of your church. They not only determine the ministries of your church, but they determine the level of success of those ministries! I am also thinking about Rick Warren’s S.H.A.P.E. philosophy. He says that a helpful way for a person to figure out what ministry God has designed them for is to assess their S.H.A.P.E. – Spiritual gifts, Heart, Abilities, Personality, and Experiences. When we assess those five areas of our life, we get a good picture of both how God has designed us intrinsically, and how he has shaped us by our experiences in life. I’ve never considered this before, but I think you could assess the S.H.A.P.E. of an entire church. On a whole, what types of spiritual gifting does the church have? What do the people in your church really get passionate about? What are the skillsets of the people in your church? What kind of a personality does your church possess? Finally, what experiences has your church body gone through, as a group? Let me finish with this analogy Let’s say you bought a five-acre plot of land just covered with trees, thick trees. When I was a kid, we’d call them, “the woods”. We would say we were going to play in “the woods.” So you bought a chunk of land just covered with “woods.” Let’s say you wanted to know what was in those woods. Would you google “What is in the woods?” Would you do a search on environmental sites to try to determine what is generally in the woods? What you ask people in your town what they think is usually in “the woods” around them? No to all of the above, if you really want to know. Here’s what you would do – take a walk in the woods! Look! Figure it out for yourself! So, if you want to decide what kinds of ministries you should have in your church, would you google, “important church ministries”? Maybe you’d do a search for “ministries in a small church”? No, and no. Take a walk! Talk to the people in your church. Get to know them. Why, you could even order Rick’s Purpose Driven S.H.A.P.E. class materials and run people through them if you wanted to. These were just some random thoughts as I consider the wonderful talk Jonny and I had with Mark, Tory, and Steve. You’re going to enjoy episode #70. And you’ll be challenged and encouraged too. I promise. Have a great week leading, feeding, and LOVING your people! What if God isn’t who you think he is, and neither are you? That is the subtitle to the book, The Cure, which our guest from last week’s podcast authored – John Lynch. BUT, this week we will talk with Karl Vaters from NewSmallChurch.com about megachurches, and our attitude toward them. Our point will be that NewSmallChurch.com and 200churches.com, while cheerleading small church pastors and their churches, are not out to bash or trash the Biggee Big Churches! So, let’s take The Cure’s subtitle and adjust it a bit to make it the subtitle to this week’s podcast, episode 65: What if your church isn’t what you think it is, and neither are you?! Did you think that your church, because it’s small, is not quite as important or significant as the larger church? Maybe you thought that your church is not as valuable to the Kingdom as First Megachurch across town.
Have you considered yourself not quite as valuable or vital to the Kingdom of God because you only pastor 50, 150, or 300 people? I mean, you don’t command a staff of 23 or 230, so your ministry is kind of small fry compared to the Big Boys, right? Of course. You’re somebody, but you could easily be replaced. You’re not nobody, but you’re only a notch or to above it. Well, what if your church isn’t what you think it is, and neither are you?! What if your church was significant, vital, valuable, important, and key to what God is doing in your community? What if, without your church, scores or hundreds of people would be without Christ over the past two decades, Christian families would be pagan, and missionaries wouldn’t have been sent to the field? What if your church is the central location of how God is showing love to your neighborhood? What if you were an important and substantial force for good in your community as a Christian pastor and leader? Maybe the children of your church are forming what will be a lifelong love and respect for God and his Word because of how you interact with them and lead their parents and your congregation? What if you knew that future pastors, missionaries, godly business leaders, neighborhood evangelists, teachers, doctors, scientists, or national leaders were growing up in your church right now, and that you were having an enormous influence on the way that they will love and lead in the future? What if comparing your church to the megachurch was like comparing a tire to an engine, or a social worker to a brain surgeon? All four of them are much needed and important, but they all have different responsibilities and functions. They really cannot be compared. If you were a social worker, should you spend most of your time feeling inferior to the brain surgeon? No! You should spend your time helping people find answers and solutions and making their lives better. If you were a tire, should you stare endlessly in envy toward the engine? No! You should keep your grip on the road and maintain the fine looking machine you’re carrying. Are you a pastor? Is your church a real church? Is it a group of Christ-followers joined together for the purpose of worshiping God, growing spiritually, serving others in love, and reaching the lost with the Gospel through message, care, mercy and justice? Then stand tall! On Wednesday, I hope we are able to get you to think about your church differently, and about yourself as a pastor with pride and pleasure at what you can do in the Kingdom of God. And we won’t bash the megachurches. We love them! And we love the medium, large, and biggie big churches too! Happy Monday pastors. We get to do this.
What are the three dangers you ask? Here they are, so that you can be thinking about them as you listen to the podcast:
1. Believing that if the church is small it doesn’t make a big difference. 2. Chasing feeling good over doing right. 3. Trading dreams for duty. In this episode, we explore these three in detail with the Executive Pastor of 12stone church in Lawrenceville, GA, Dan "The Enforcer" Reiland.
This is a great conversation where Dan joins us for the entire episode. There is also a cameo appearance by a good friend of Jonny's. In this episode we get to know Dan just a little more, and we all explore together these three dangers that all churches face, but especially small churches.
I (Jeff) just returned a few hours ago from Bethel Seminary in St. Paul, MN. I spent four days in the last class I will have for a Master's degree. Five nights of moderate sleep deprivation leaves this post uncharacteristically short - so hurry on over and listen to the podcast. We'll catch up again on Friday! You can find more of Dan Reiland at www.danreiland.com! Click on his picture above to check out his book. Amplified Leadership, on Amazon. Wow. Don’t you hate it when something you preach on preaches right back at you?! That happened this weekend. Wanna hear about it? I’ll tell ya anyway… By November of 2013, our offerings were running behind budget by a fair amount. What do you do as a pastor? Worry? Fret? Fear? Question? Brood? Second guess? Scheme? Yes! I do all of the above. If you’re like me, you could pick out a couple on this list to join me in. I think that you’re like me. In December of last year (seven weeks ago), our congregation took a special offering and brought us clear back into the black, and into a better position than we were a year ago. I felt as though I had lived through a near-death experience.
So starting 2014, I unconsciously assumed a posture of fear and dread. Will this happen all over again? Will our offerings support our budget? Will I be able to pay staff all year? What if? What then? Oh dear… Yeah, full of faith, aren’t I?! Here’s where the AHA! moment comes in. We are preaching in Hosea. Yes, Hosea, and it actually challenged me directly. We defined four areas of sin that Hosea said the Israelites were guilty of, and one of those areas was this: Pursued foreign gods/powers for protection and provision. Israel forgot that it was God who gave them what they needed. They called out to their lovers, went to the great king, called to Egypt and turned to Assyria. They did not trust in the LORD their God to take care of them, or to provide for their needs! Instead, they adulterated after other gods. When I saw this fact about the Israelites, I realized I was being just like them. Who or what was I looking to as the source of what we need? Who or what was going to source us? From what source would our provision come? The answer is God, and I needed to both realize it, and affirm it in my heart. “This is your church God, and I trust you to supply what we need here for this budget year. I will not go after “other lovers” or trust in man – my hope is in you!” Are you experiencing budget troubles in your church? Do you trust yourself to scheme and dream, robbing Peter to pay Paul? If your hope is in anyone or anything but God and God alone, you may be guilty of the Israelites’ sins in Hosea’s day. Turn to God in full trust, confidence, and dependence! He can be trusted. Don’t miss what God wants to show you, that he loves you and will provide in his way and timing. Don’t turn to foreign gods or powers; turn to Jesus, he is your source. Trust God for what your church needs, he can be trusted! p.s. This Wednesday we are joined by Dan Reiland, The Pastor's Coach on the 200churches Podcast! When I was 17 years old, I got both my driver’s license and a car. My mother bought a new car, and gave me her old one. I was the proud recipient of a 1973, mint green, Chevy Impala 9-Passenger Station Wagon. It was a kid-cruiser, a grocery-getter. And it also took a four-lane highway to do a U-turn… unless that turn was on solid ice. My next car was a German Opel. It was small. I could get into, and out of, the smallest of parking spaces, and I could do a U-turn on a sidewalk. Well, almost. I found out that when it comes to cars, the smaller the car, the easier and quicker the turns. For the record, I’ve never owned, driven, or even seen – a Lamborghini! What’s true for cars is also true for churches. The smaller the church, the easier and quicker the turns. If you pastor a small church, you are able to change things quickly, often on the fly. That is a perk every small church pastor should enjoy, and utilize.
It happened to me, and for me, this morning. Jonny and I spent a fair amount of energy preparing a tag team message for this weekend. We invested prayer, discussion, debate, a short shouting match, and much study into this message. We achieved some serious spiritual and emotional focus. We practiced it on Saturday night, and went home prepared, and excited, having asked God to do his work on Sunday morning, the work we could not do. WHAT HAPPENED... On Sunday morning I taught a Membership Class with 15 people from 8:30 – 10:00am. Our service starts at 10:30. At 9:55am, as I was landing the “Membership Class plane”, Jonny walked in and whispered in my ear, “we’re headed to Sioux Falls.” That meant he was leaving right then, at the last minute, to tend to an emergency situation. He quickly turned and walked out, waiting for no reply from me. He didn’t need one. He would not be with me to give the message. Could I do it myself? I sure could. No problem. But we had a special guest with us this weekend. He had spoken to some adult classes in the auditorium during the 9:00 Sunday School hour. He was phenomenal. “God, are you giving me an opportunity here?” I wondered if God was allowing this guest and me to, last minute, tag team the morning service together? At 10:20 I met with this man, Eric, in my office – ten minutes, mind you, before the service would start. He agreed with me that the Holy Spirit was leading us to do the service together. He was so ready in his heart to share with our people in this "moment". Our prepared message would wait another week. Eric and I were on! After talking with the morning service coordinator at 10:25, Eric and I spent five minutes in prayer, asking God to use this service to minister to the people who were there. There were just over 200 people in the service this weekend – hence, our “200church.” J THE RESULT... Eric shared passionately about his commitment to orphan care in Nigeria, his native country. He talked about what God was doing through his orphanage there, the Cornerstone of Hope. I played a somewhat cameo role, but was able to tie in his passion with the theme of our current series. It was a fantastic service. Truthfully, I left a lot of details about this weekend out of this blog post. It was really an amazing weekend, in both good, and difficult ways. But throughout Sunday morning I was so aware of God directing us, and the size of our church helping us pull off some necessary and wonderful last minute changes. In a 1973 Family Wagon Church, I would never have been able to pull off changing the service in literally five minutes, but in my Lamborghini Church it was not only possible, but fun! In our 200churches, we can do this. It is a pleasure and a privilege. I enjoyed it and am thankful for it. We pulled it off, and people were blessed. HOW ABOUT YOU? Pastor, are you thankful, or resentful, for your small church? You can focus on the positives, or the negatives. Choose to focus on the positives – the benefits, the opportunities, and the blessings of small church ministry. When you do that, you will BLESS your people! Your Lamborghini church is making a difference in the Kingdom of God! This week our theme has been strengths and weaknesses. We introduced it on Monday and talked about it on our podcast on Wednesday, outlining eighteen reasons why they both make our ministry what it is. Now, there are two final steps you must take to leverage both your strengths and your weaknesses. The first step is to provide a crystal clear answer to these two questions:
Maybe you've never actually put pen to paper, or fingers to keyboard, to list them. You may need a close friend or spouse to help you with this. Everyone has strengths, and everyone has weaknesses. Having them is not the question – you have both! The question is, what, exactly, are they? So list the top three. How about this, I’ll go first – deal? Here are mine: Strengths: 1) Relationality. I am a highly relational person. I connect easily and put people at ease in my presence. 2) Communication. I know how to communicate with people in small and large groups. 3) I have the gift of service. I love to serve people and help others. Weaknesses: 1) Administration. I am not a good organizer of details. I live in the moment and tend to forget last hour. 2) I am a people pleaser. This is the dark side of the gift of service. I like to make others happy. 3) I often lack sustained focus or follow-through. I lose interest, get busy with something else, and drop projects before they are completed. There you go. That’s me. The good, bad, and ugly. (well, mostly ugly…) Now, where are your lists? C’mon, just take a couple minutes and list those six areas. As I look at my six, it occurs to me that I probably should find out what to do about them! What should I do with my strengths? What should I do about my weaknesses? This brings us to the second step: Figure out how both of those lists inform what you do. If we don’t understand how those things affect us, we will never prioritize our lives in ways that build up the Kingdom of God, and bring us fulfillment and joy. When I was a young pastor, I had no idea I had any weaknesses, and thought that anything that had to do with ministry, must be a strength of mine. In fact, I never considered my weaknesses, nor had I ever doubted that I was strong in every ministry area. When someone would point out a weaknesses or flaw to me, or suggest that I might not be good at some aspect of ministry, I would get defensive. I truly believed that if those critiques were true, they threatened my staying power in ministry. So, step two, what to do about them? Let’s answer in a very general way, and then you can apply it to your specific strengths and weaknesses. First, you should work on your strengths, and in your strength areas. These are the areas where you are already naturally good, and can get really great if you work on them. Second, you should bring others around you who are strong in your weak areas, and let them help you. After all, you are naturally not good in these areas, and you will likely never be great in them. Remember, this is how God wired you, so get others involved and lean on them. I work on loving and caring for people, my public and private communication, and serving and helping others. I am really good in these areas. At the same time I try to find others to help me organize and plan. I try to have the people closest to me alert me when they see me caving in to others, just to please them. And I build teamwork with others who will insist I follow through to the end of a project. Go ahead and list your strengths and weaknesses – investing effort and work in your strength zones, and allowing others to shore up your weaknesses. Finally, rejoice in the way God made you! David said “fearfully and wonderfully” about how we were made (Psalm 139) and that God knows us fully, because he made us. Nothing is hidden from him. If he had wanted me to be a wiz-bang administrator, he would have made me one! Well, I’m not one, and that’s okay. The way God designed you is okay too, in your 200church, with the people you have, for such a time as this. How have you seen God use both your strengths and your weaknesses in your 200church ministry?
In this episode we explore the whole issue of strengths and weaknesses, with just a smattering of humor, of course. We have a feeling that too many of us 200church pastors feel badly about our weaknesses, and spend too much time worrying about them.
Too many pastors are beaten down by mostly honest and innocent church members who constantly try to “help” their pastor by reminding him or her to get better in their weakest areas. In reality, our weak areas will always be weaker. We cannot be great at everything. And in some areas we will just never be that good. Honestly, you didn't really think you’d be good at everything, did you?
Focusing on our weaknesses and trying to make them stronger will only frustrate and discourage us, and others. We can simply acknowledge our weaknesses, allow for them, involve others in our lives who are strong in those areas, and move on! In fact, pastors can be just as hampered in their ministry by their strengths, maybe even more hampered! By viewing their strengths as “free money” pastors can hurt themselves by 1) reducing preparation time because they over-rely on their gift, or 2) becoming prideful in their good work, and 3) not including others in the ministry because they themselves do the job just fine. Below are eighteen reasons (aren't you glad this isn't a sermon?!) why you should view both your strengths AND your weaknesses as equally valuable, because they reflect who God made you to be as a pastor, shepherd, leader, and servant. First, your weaknesses:
Second, your strengths:
We hope you are encouraged and challenged by this podcast. Remember, your pastoral leadership is a huge deal in the Kingdom of God! Strengths and weaknesses – aren't you sick of hearing that phrase?! In every interview we have ever had, don’t we all get the same question, “Now, would you please tell me what you think are your strengths and weaknesses?” A simple variation of that question would be so welcome – just leave out “and weaknesses?” Who in the world wants to share their weaknesses? Honestly, not me, and I imagine, neither do you. My strengths? Oh yes, but not my weaknesses. Weaknesses
After all, weaknesses are, well, weak! They are negative. They are the side of ourselves we would like to hide. They represent the foot we do not want to put forward. They are left-handed, handicapped, and about as welcome as bounced checks. To put it bluntly, weaknesses are bad, and portray the worst about us. Your weaknesses might be fear, disorganization, lack of courage, an inability to work with numbers, no relational acumen, bad money handler, indecisive, lack of focus, poor communication skills, or that you talk too much. Strengths Strengths, on the other hand, are what we are proud of! We revel in our strengths, and want to promote and publicize them for the entire world to see. We are strong in our strengths, and attractive in our strengths, and powerful in our strengths, and we like ourselves more as we see ourselves through the prism of our strengths. Maybe you are a great money manager, have good people skills, are an excellent communicator (both written and verbal!), can navigate a large organization well, or are a skilled administrator. Maybe your strength is preaching, counseling, or raising money. Strengths are good, beneficial, profitable, and productive. We thank God for our strengths and know that we will always do well if we work within our strength zone. To be clear, strengths are good and weaknesses are bad. Now, wait just a cotton pickin' minute! But… wait a minute! Are they really? What if, without being disingenuous hucksters, we told you that your weaknesses were just as important as your strengths? What if you didn't have to be embarrassed about your weaknesses, but that you could embrace them, welcome them into your day, and use them to leverage your best ministry? What if you found out that your weaknesses were just as important as your strengths when it came to your ministry? What if you didn't have to run away from them anymore, and you didn't have to try to improve them? Podcast Episode 30 - this Wednesday Well, on Wednesday’s Episode 30 of the 200churches Podcast, that’s exactly what we are going to tell you, and more. We will give you all the reasons why both your strengths, and your weaknesses, equally, make your ministry what it is, as a pastor of a 200church. We are excited to share Episode 30 with you and really believe it will encourage you in your ministry. Don’t miss Wednesday’s podcast! In the meantime, make a list of all your strengths and weaknesses, and bring them with you when you listen. You do know them, don’t you?? |
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