Our guest and friend this week and next, for episodes 131/132, is Deon Wynia. Deon is a licensed Therapist and works at Bethesda Christian Counseling in our town.
Deon works with pastors and church leaders to help them achieve unity and work through leadership issues and challenges between leaders in the church, and also between the church family and it's leadership. Deon has a lot of experience helping pastors and church leaders work through junk! His goal for them is reconciliation, trust, and love. Our two conversations with Deon in episodes 131/132 will really help you as you think through your own leadership relationships in your 200church. Deon is a great friend. He is soft spoken, but his words really pack a punch! Deon has counseled with both Jonny and me in the past, but don't blame him for us... Enjoy the episodes! Episode 129 - Ministry Skills 101 - How To Manage Offending and Being Offended In Ministry7/10/2015
Dave Jacobs again joins the guys to talk about the inner life of a pastor and how he or she works through situations when they offend others, or are themselves offended.
This is a very practical episode and also very personal for the pastor, as he or she deals with this reality on at least a monthly basis. Plan to take notes and be challenged in how you conduct yourself in ministry as you interact with your congregation. Visit Dave at SmallChurchPastor.Com! If you need someone to talk to about your ministry challenges, or want help in crafting a personal pastoral plan for growth, consider hiring Dave on as a personal pastor coach! He specializes in small church pastors. At the least, allow yourself the pleasure of getting his book, Mile Wide Inch Deep, and use it to develop yourself as a person and a pastor. Everybody wants to talk about race. Nobody wants to talk about race. Probably one of the most life-changing things I ever learned was this: race isn’t about skin color, it’s about power. Even as I write that, I know there are some who disagree. Many think that race is skin color, and that’s all. In this thinking, the term “racism” usually only refers to one person actively thinking less of another person because of the color of their skin.
If you follow this thinking, ideas like “systemic racism,” “white privilege,” and “Black/Latino/Asian experience” are liberal academic ideas, unrelated to the real interworking of American society. This view led one popular political firebrand to recently proclaim: “there is more cholera than racism in America.” She came to this conclusion because her definition of racism is very narrow. We have laws against discrimination, so racism is dead. Race has become a politicized issue. Unfortunately, labels like “liberal,” “conservative,” “left,” and “right” start to define positions and people start to take sides. As pastors, our concern should have nothing to do with politics, and everything to do with the people of God. We all have our own political opinions, but those opinions mean nothing to me compared to how I feel about the witness of the Church to the world. And I’m worried about our witness. I’m worried that the Church is the most segregated institution in America. I’m worried that many Christians put their political beliefs, left or right, ahead of their concern for their neighbor. I’m worried that we worship a God who became human and understands the human experience, but we more often than not don’t try to understand the experiences of our brothers and sisters. Truthfully, I’m worried for my sons and the world they are going to live in. That Joseph, our son who was adopted from Nigeria, will have troubles and concerns that our biological son Asher will never have breaks my heart. I know the world is broken in ways that only Jesus can heal, but I’m worried that we who make up the body of Jesus aren’t doing the healing. I believe that race is a social construct that is primarily about power, not skin color. As a white male, I recognize that I occupy a space of privilege in society that minorities do not. That does not mean that a minority can’t be successful or a white person can’t struggle through life, nor do I think it means that all white people are terrible and racist. What it means is that my culture is the “default” setting for media, education, marketing, and even Christianity. It means that I’m the “tall guy,” the “guy with long hair,” or the “loud and crazy guy,” but never the “white guy.” It means that I don’t get second looks when I walk into stores or profiled for my race by police. It means that I can move freely through life without wondering if my skin tone is causing alarm, generating stares, creating curiosity, or even becoming a topic of conversation. I have default status. The reality is that I wouldn’t recognize any of this if I didn’t take the experiences of minorities seriously. If I didn’t have Hispanic friends who had to constantly hear Mexican jokes despite not being from Mexico. If I didn’t listen to black friends talk about being followed through stores by security or being pulled over simply so a police officer could “find out what they were up to.” If I didn’t talk about race, and more importantly, if I didn’t listen about race, I wouldn’t know that people are hurting. That people are being made to feel less than. That people are being otherized in every sphere of society. As a follower of Christ, I affirm the inherent dignity of every human as an image bearer of God. And as a Christian, I believe the Church must be a space where Paul’s incredible vision of radical equality found in Galatians 3:28 is a reality. Unfortunately, there will always be inequality and stratification in society. I celebrate how far American society has come, but I am heartbroken by the realization that until Jesus comes, the world can never be fixed. But I have hope that the body of Christ can be a beacon to the watching world. That the Church can be a place where all nations gather together to worship, each bringing a unique and beautiful experience that enriches how we all understand and honor God. I have hope that we can talk about race and love our neighbors for the people that God created them to be. And I have hope that, in Christ, we can be a people who are always more concerned with the dignity and experiences of others than we are for ourselves. That’s what Christ did for us, and what he’s called us to do for others.
Jeff and Jonny had the best time talking with Christena Cleveland on the campus of Bethel University recently. We "just happened" to set up a remote 200churches Studio at Bethel, and Christena "just happened" to stop by to talk with us!
Christena was unbelievably delightful to talk with and we are so happy to share our conversation with you. We got into the subject of race and reconciliation, so if you hear some things that you don't normally hear, we ask you to listen very closely, and we guarantee you will gain some great perspectives from Dr. Cleveland. In the podcast episode Christena talks about resources on her website for small church pastors to use to begin thinking about how they can help their churches remove the barriers between groups separated by age, economic status, health, or race. You can find those resources on her page here. Can we introduce her by the following video clip? Then below the video, we'll give you more information from her website at ChristenaCleveland.com.
Christena Cleveland is a social psychologist, author, speaker and professor with a hopeful passion for overcoming cultural divisions in groups. Drawing from a vast body of research, she uncovers the underlying processes that affect relationships within and between groups and helps leaders understand how to promote an appreciation for diversity and build effective collaborations with diverse groups.
In 2014, Christianity Today magazine named her one of “33 Under 33” (millennials leading the next generation of Christian faith) and JET magazine identified her one as of 5 “online shepherds to follow.” Christena is the author of Disunity in Christ: Uncovering the Hidden Forces that Keep Us Apart, a 2013 Leadership Journal Book Award winner. She’s currently writing The Priesthood of the Privileged (InterVarsity Press) which examines power and inequality in the Church. She earned a B.A. from Dartmouth College and a Ph.D. from the University of California Santa Barbara. An award-winning researcher and gifted teacher, she has published numerous scholarly articles and is an associate professor of reconciliation studies at Bethel University. Beyond academic experience, Christena brings organizational experience to her efforts to build unity. She coaches pastors and leaders on multicultural issues and speaks regularly. |
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